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Author Topic: A Serbian Film  (Read 175 times) Share

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Illusion

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A Serbian Film
« on: October 26, 2010, 10:58:31 AM »

Anybody watched it?  Here's it's Wiki.

Like seriously WTF is that shit.  Is that what shock movies have evolved to now?  The guy claims it's showing what his government has done to his people and all that.  It looks like some reviewers agree with him and others don't, I haven't watched it so I don't know.  I just know that I won't be watching it, there has to be a line somewhere.

If you need newborn baby rape and somebody killing somebody with his boner to put across a message then you fucking suck at film.  Or at least writing, maybe it's different in the way it's shot.
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Hazzy

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Re: A Serbian Film
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2010, 09:08:07 AM »

I don't get how you want this banned though. You say there has to be a line - why? All you're saying is that you've found your line. You don't want to watch the film. And you don't have to. But some people are into films that challenge their morals or their stomach, or into whatever genre the film is, or into Serbian history or shock cinema etc. etc.

No babies were actually raped. It's an idea. That doesn't make this unartistic or worthy of banning. It's just, in your opinion, shit and stupid and you don't like it.

Like how in the early days Christian groups would lobby and get a film banned because it showed skin or had two characters sharing a bed or whatever. That was their line, new born baby rape is your line, doesn't mean either should be banned.
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[15:12:47] Gerrvaise says:
i used to strip action men and play with them in the bath

Fan

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Re: A Serbian Film
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2010, 09:42:29 AM »

  • I haven't seen the film, so I'm just going to assume it's your typical shock film. I do consider those inartistic. Film makers who have to use shock value as a crutch for their work do not deserve to be in the industry. Those films are garbage. I don't think it should be banned though. People should be allowed to express themselves freely as long as it does not infringe on the rights of others, no matter how asinine their expression happens to be (see:TNA Management).
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    Illusion

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    Re: A Serbian Film
    « Reply #3 on: October 27, 2010, 10:24:42 AM »

    Ok I never said it should be banned and if you compare me to a christian again I'm going to have to rape you to show you how unchristian I am.

    They're getting 4 minutes cut out here to get an 18 rating and I said it's the first time I don't disagree with that.  I'm guessing it's the same story and everything but minus the baby rape.  If that and I'm guessing some of the other worse stuff is cut out is that neccesary to the "story" and "message" then it wasn't done very well in the first place and the writer/director etc. should question if this was the best plot they could come up with to do what they wanted to do.
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    Hazzy

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    Re: A Serbian Film
    « Reply #4 on: October 28, 2010, 05:48:55 AM »

  • But I've always hated it when a teacher says "how could this be done differently" - it couldnt be done differently, or it wouldn't be what it is, and we'd be watching a different film.

    This guy has made a film, his personal vision, and because YOU find it offensive you think it should be cut. Banning and cutting is the same thing, because the original has been effectively banned unless they change it.

    Whether you think its artistic, or good, or shit storytelling or whatever, doesn't take away the fact that it IS art. By definition. And who are you or any other board of censors to decide what an adult audience wants to or shouldn't be able to see.
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    [15:12:47] Gerrvaise says:
    i used to strip action men and play with them in the bath

    The Headliner

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    Re: A Serbian Film
    « Reply #5 on: October 28, 2010, 06:54:37 AM »

    Just to play devil's advocate here - because I basically agree with you Hazzy - let's think about the inclusion of these scenes not as "too shocking/disgusting" but "socially irresponsible."

    I'm referring to the baby rape in particular. A scene like that could, in the wrong person, awaken feelings they didn't know they had, and start them on a slippery slope at the end of which real children are abused.

    (Please wait for second post, phone has a character limit.)
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    The Headliner

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    Re: A Serbian Film
    « Reply #6 on: October 28, 2010, 07:04:36 AM »

    No one's going to rush out and rape babies after watching it, just like no one became killers after seeing Saw. But unlike murder, there are conceilable, incremental steps in the "awakening" of a paedophile - exploring pictures on the Internet, etc, until one day they eventually go so far as to act out the sick fantasies they've cultivated over time. This film could be the flicking of the switch in their heads that starts it all, when otherwise their unusual feelings would have remained repressed.
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    Illusion

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    Re: A Serbian Film
    « Reply #7 on: October 28, 2010, 11:45:20 AM »

  • I wouldn't cut anything out but that's what he's being forced to do and it's one of those times where you can see why.  If it wasn't censored I still wouldn't want to see it and that would be that.

    It's like those artists that take photos of nude 10 year olds.  They call it art but how is it any different from child porn?  You think things shouldn't be censored and that's a load of crap to me because then it opens up the doors to all kinds of fucked up stuff.  This guy showed the implied rape of a new born baby.  What if everything was uncensored and you started seeing scenes of child sex scenes in movies?  You don't think that's not going to open up some dark doors?  Just because the children wouldn't actually be having sex doesn't mean it's not child porn.  It would become a loophole and all kinds of sick fucks would start doing it.  What if that Austrian guy set up a camera in his dungeon and said that his daughter and all their little incest babies was just performance art?  If there were no censorship rules he might get away with it.

    There should be a line and censorship rules.

    It's not like they're even that strict about it these days.  You have all kinds of fucked up and twisted films being released all the time lately.  None of which needed to go to the level that this guy did to create shock.

    He could have easily came up with something else that said "in Serbia you're fucked as soon as you're born" without literally showing a baby being fucked.  It wouldn't make the film different at all.  Well actually it would, it would be less shocking but only because, well, who the fuck even does that?  If nobody knew of this scene and he changed it then it would be the same film, same reaction from audience, same target audience, same genre, same plot etc. and the only thing that would be changed is that more people would go to see it and not be turned off by that scene.

    It could be done differently and be the same movie and do what he wants it to do.  It might not be his vision but if he's getting it distributed then it becomes about the audience so he should have took that under consideration.

    Maybe he's just a genius.  It did give him more attention than ever but now he has to cut the stuff out which turns away the people that did want to see it as well as the people that decided they didn't want to watch it because of that scene.  There's people that won't watch because of that scene is so messed up, and now there's people that won't see it becuase they feel like it's been butchered and the graphic stuff is what appealed to them. 

    There's better ways to do things so that whole "you can't do things differently because then it becomes different" is a really weak ass argument.  He's basically shot himself in the foot with the UK audience now.  There's no way as many people will go to see it just because he went for the cheap visual shocks.
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    Hazzy

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    Re: A Serbian Film
    « Reply #8 on: October 28, 2010, 03:31:44 PM »

    I already explained to you when you first brought all this up that there is a line - if someone or something is getting hurt, then its not art. If kids have fake sex in a film, I still agree that it shouldn't be censored. If everyone is consenting, no one is unwillingly being harmed (although could make an argument that its affecting the kids mentally, but look at child stars that just act in disney movies, they grow up more fucked than most real life rape victims...). So saying the Austrian dungeon stuff could be excused as art isn't true - he could say its art as much as he wants, but it's abuse, pure and simple. And underage people having sex is quite common in European films anyway... like Let The Right One In, I think I remember a scene where both the kids are in bed and when we studied it at uni the lecturer was talking about how it implies they had sex. I can't remember the scene so iunno, but like all coming of age movies deal with underage sexuality.

    I don't know how anyone has the right to restrict and censor someone's imagination. No baby was harmed, no baby was raped, it's rated over 18 so no kids are going to see it. It's all consenting adults. You go to the cinema you enter into a contract to watch the film the director has made. If you don't like it, then post a review saying that, but don't censor other people from seeing it.

    I mean where would the line be ok for you? If it was an animation? What if it was in South Park and there was a baby fucker episode that's some kind of ironic twist on the King Herod/Jesus story where someone is going round raping everyone under two, and at one point it's implied he rapes a woman whilst she gives birth. Would that be as fucked up? What if it's a stick figure cartoon with a scribble next to a guys penis that has an arrow saying "this is a baby getting raped".

    Actually ironically that last one probably would be illegal, because you can't even draw child porn, so if you explicitly say the scribble is a baby then it would probably get you put in jail.

    And the issue isn't he could have come up with something different. He could have, he could have made a different film. But he didn't. He made this. The fact is you just don't like it, don't want to see it, and apparently think it's an acceptable example of film censorship.

    But ART SHOULD NEVER BE CENSORED.

    You know why loads of statues have fig leaves over their dicks or just their dicks missing completely? Cause when Christianity was particularly strong at some point in history, don't know exactly when, they thought it was sick and would corrupt people's minds, so they lobbed them all off. Some great works of art, statues that someone has spent probably weeks or months sculpting to perfection, and some conservative bastard comes along and knocks part of it off - forever. Can't just regrow it or glue another one back on.

    Same should be for film, paintings etc. etc.

    Him trying to appeal to a broader audience has nothing to do with it either. He might not want to be making a blockbuster that's gunna be number one at the box office. He's made a film to make a statement. If he wants a wider audience, then he could easily release another cut of the film without baby rape and the dick murder or whatever, as well as a director's cut version which is fully intact. But it would be his choice. It shouldn't be the choice of some censor board.
    « Last Edit: October 28, 2010, 03:35:09 PM by Hazzy »
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    Quote
    [15:12:47] Gerrvaise says:
    i used to strip action men and play with them in the bath